Visual sensor and painted robot

  1. 4 months ago

    Beepbloop35211

    May 4 Some where on Earth 35211C

    Since the visual sensor usese tracks colour, and vex allows decorative paint job on robots, a team could paint their robot blue or red to distract the other team's visual sensor. Let's say that I am trying to identify a red flag from a very close by poistion and a robot painted red is some destence away. Isn't the visual sensor going to precive both of them as red object in similar size? I know that other things such as number plate or just someone wearing a red shirt can be an interference, but I still think that painting the robot in game object colour should be ban.

  2. tabor473

    May 4 V5 Beta Tester OYES, WPI

    @Beepbloop35211 Since the visual sensor usese tracks colour, and vex allows decorative paint job on robots, a team could paint their robot blue or red to distract the other team's visual sensor. Let's say that I am trying to identify a red flag from a very close by poistion and a robot painted red is some destence away. Isn't the visual sensor going to precive both of them as red object in similar size? I know that other things such as number plate or just someone wearing a red shirt can be an interference, but I still think that painting the robot in game object colour should be ban.

    VEX doesn't allow "decorative paint jobs". VEX allows "non functional decoration". Your use case doesn't sound Non functional to me.

  3. Silicon

    May 4 Glen Allen, Virginia Ex 8086a

    If I paint my robot bright green it would be conpletely non functional from my viewpoint. Good teams will have size and location and color connection parts in code, so they will be able to ignore everything other than just putting flags on your robot. Also this hurts your alliance partner.

  4. Beepbloop35211

    May 4 Some where on Earth 35211C

    @tabor473 VEX doesn't allow "decorative paint jobs". VEX allows "non functional decoration". Your use case doesn't sound Non functional to me.

    Since you are a beta tester is paint job on robot going to be significant enough to effect the visual.

  5. Barin

    May 4 Arizona

    @Beepbloop35211 Since you are a beta tester is paint job on robot going to be significant enough to effect the visual.

    This is a very vague question. The answer most probably is it depends.

    For example, if you have a solid piece of plastic, painted bright red, comprising most of one side of your robot, the vision sensor will most likely recognize it.

    On the other hand, if your entire robot was painted a more subtle red and didn't have much of a large, coplanar area of material, the shadows might mean the vision sensor doesn't even recognize it as a blob.

    Of course, if your programming (filtering) is good enough, none of this matters. Your program will only ever recognize flags as flags and all other, irrelevant blobs as immaterial. The most obvious way to accomplish this would be sensor fusion and masking (only accounting for blobs in a certain region of the view).

  6. callen

    May 4 Braintree, MA, USA

    I expect you'd get in trouble for painting most of your robot black except for a few red or blue rectangles about the size of the flags. What would be really funny would be if those squares were trap doors leading to intakes so another robot might shoot a ball right into your intake.

  7. TriDragon

    May 4 Tampa, FL 6430 - Mentor

    This is an excellent point, putting a flag on the side of your robot with your team number under it isn’t illegal.... yet

  8. ZachDaChampion

    May 4 Fort Lauderdale, Florida 77788J

    @callen I expect you'd get in trouble for painting most of your robot black except for a few red or blue rectangles about the size of the flags. What would be really funny would be if those squares were trap doors leading to intakes so another robot might shoot a ball right into your intake.

    YES

  9. This is why FRC uses retro-reflective targets. There's no reason to have retro-reflective tape on your robot in the shape of a target.

    I think it would be unfair to punish a team that wants to make their robot look nice in order to avoid proper engineering (either through filtering on the team side, or through the implementation of LED rings and retro-reflective flags on VEX's side).

  10. tabor473

    May 5 V5 Beta Tester OYES, WPI

    @TriDragon This is an excellent point, putting a flag on the side of your robot with your team number under it isn’t illegal.... yet

    @tabor473 VEX doesn't allow "decorative paint jobs". VEX allows "non functional decoration". Your use case doesn't sound Non functional to me.

  11. AlexM_4478X

    May 5 Monroe, CT 4478X

    I understand the point being made here, but the color sensor is actually very powerful. The VEX sensor is based off of this PIXY camera that achieves the same functions.

    I believe that the camera should be able to differentiate between a flag and a robot if programmed correctly

  12. Vyx

    May 5 Florida 33328A

    @AlexM_4478X I understand the point being made here, but the color sensor is actually very powerful. The VEX sensor is based off of this PIXY camera that achieves the same functions.

    I believe that the camera should be able to differentiate between a flag and a robot if programmed correctly

    does this mean with really bad basic programming the robot would shoot at someone standing nearby wearing a red or blue shirt?

  13. AlexM_4478X

    May 5 Monroe, CT 4478X

    @Vyx does this mean with really bad basic programming the robot would shoot at someone standing nearby wearing a red or blue shirt?

    I believe so. It seems that the Pixy camera can define objects by their color, size, and shape, so if the programming that identifies a ball only accounts for color, then it could very well shoot at a spectator/drive team member, or even, back to the original topic, a robot with that color of decoration. However this should be easily mitigated by adding a distinction between objects based on size and shape as well

  14. Royal_Waffle

    May 7 Washington State 3249Z -- team name undetermine...

    @AlexM_4478X I believe so. It seems that the Pixy camera can define objects by their color, size, and shape, so if the programming that identifies a ball only accounts for color, then it could very well shoot at a spectator/drive team member, or even, back to the original topic, a robot with that color of decoration. However this should be easily mitigated by adding a distinction between objects based on size and shape as well

    *evil laugh*

  15. AlexM_4478X

    May 7 Monroe, CT 4478X

    @Royal_xD *evil laugh*

    Our drive team sometimes wears red hats... So I guess there may be a mutiny among us...

  16. Who knows the code for vision sensor ????

  17. callen

    May 16 Braintree, MA, USA

    @1378 Yung Gravy Who knows the code for vision sensor ????

    Assuming you're working in VEX C++, some are listed on the V5 architecture page. For example, Vision.takeSnapShot().

    Go down to "Vision" here:
    https://www.vexrobotics.com/v5-architecture.html

  18. last week

    It could be argued that the decorations are serving a purpose, which is to distract vision sensors.

  19. lacsap

    Sep 14 Event Partner, V5 Beta Tester Massachusetts 9791[a-z]

    @caek It could be argued that the decorations are serving a purpose, which is to distract vision sensors.

    Old thread and prohibited to use decorations to fool a sensor. Please do not revive old threads.

  20. Xenon

    Sep 14 long beach 99999V

    what if you wear a shirt with a picture of a flag on it? =P

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