The Us open finals happened yesterday and my team(9007K X-Genius Bots) and our alliance(85048C Null Cybercats) were DQed in a really weird moment. We lost a score of 265 that would have led us to a second place finish at the us open instead the head ref gave us a DQ for no absolute reason . I will start from the top, We started our match and everything went fine. Our alliance did two dispensers and we decided to distribute the disks for maximum 4 point zone. They finished shooting and at 20 seconds they decided to extend. The Null Cybercats extended and missed the extension and decided to pull the robot back for the extension. Both of the drivers put the controller down and went to pull the robot back. After that they extended and we waited for the score to be added up. During the score being added up the Head ref said it was a DQ and many of us were surprised. The DQ was for the two drivers pulling the robot back. This was disheartening for both of our teams and we decided to appeal respecting the refs decision. Both teams were told from coaches and parents about how it is a DQ when we donât know how it is a DQ. We saw Q&As and found one asking if both drivers are allowed to pull back the robot or one. The Q&A said that both drivers are allowed to pull back the robot. We went up to the ref and showed him the Q&A and the Head Ref realized he messed up so badly that he started making excuses and kept the DQ. Why will Vex allow head refs who canât weigh the options and the appeal. We lost a whole trophies cause of the head ref dumb decision. How do we know refâs like this wonât be at worlds.
what are you asking
did your alliance expand early and also out of the field?
and then you guys went to pick the robot up?
and yeah, US open is just a â â â â â â event, refs there are horrible
worlds refs arenât so random i think? in my experience, while some of them were a bit annoying, they always new the rules, and wouldnât do random â â â â
I do wanna say that sucks when things go wrong and you know it could of been avoided. I would like to remind everyone though that Refâs, TM operators, and everyone running the events are volunteerâs, and this includes these big tournaments, none of those people are being paid or compensated besides a free shirt and a lunch maybe.
With that being said, have you brought this up to your RECF rep? I only ask cause thats really where the information should be going, since the event was posted on RECF and ran through the RECF code of conduct.
Also, as mentioned these events are entirely run by volunteers and I remember seeing an urgent call for refs and judges for the US Open the day of. Consider having some adults associated with your program become certified refs and you can help solve this problem because I can almost guarantee you that the ref you are publicly complaining about stepped in the that last minute to help save your event.
Just to clarify, the CREATE US Open is not a REC Foundation event. The REC Foundation does send the invites on behalf of CREATE based on a partnership between the two organizations. But the RECF is not involved with the planning or running of the US Open.
Please send all your feedback to CREATE: Jim Schulte is a great guy and is always striving to provide a great event.
Thanks,
Dan
Every event refs can be Very amazing and Not the best ever. My team was at a hero bot tournament and our allys controller didnt connect and they told them ''hey we are gonna connect our robot real quick since its not connected. ââ The ref didnt notice or something (I wasnât a driver so i could not see the thing up close. Worlds will not be like this I think. Always go to the EP or the running team/school if you have any questions about it.
This situation seems to be in violation of since you are exploiting the rule for strategic gain (to score more points). Read the red text underneath the rule.
Its not an strategic gain, to get more points you have to extend.
If your talking to us, it was connected but it sometimes gets disconnected. It is not for strategic gain. Simple Mistake.
Strategic gain was not the argument used for disqualification.
The same argument could be utilized if a robot was stuck in a dispenser, removed and placed back on the field.
The robot could make another try for the dispenser, attempting to achieve a strategic gain for more points.
All im gonna say is magikid had power VERY deep in the competition.
Yes, I suppose they enforce those rules quite differently in IQ than in VRC. In my head, there was a difference due to a G13 violation, but that wouldnât be the case.
Even the refs at Worlds can make mistakes. We had a team last year go to the field and was accused of changing their robot after inspection since the robot was outside the size limit and was illegal. The students tried to appeal to the ref that the size limit length included the black lines on the field but they were told to go back and fix their robot and get reinspected. Once the students got back to the pits, they informed me so I could give them the rulebook so they can go appeal once more. The referee then saw the error in his ways and just said âitâs all goodâ and blew off the situation. Now I understand that the referee may not have known, but do not assume that the refs at worlds will be perfect either. Train the kids to know the rules, teach them how to appeal, an hope that the ref will listen. Not every person will react the way you would hope. This is what makes us human. We wonât always all agree and some use their power to their advantage which can ruin an experience. Just try and do the best you can and try and enjoy your experiences in life. Wishing all of you who read this a fantastic robotics experience in your lives and for your students!!!
Please donât just pass the buck. You have allowed this kind of event, aka the âColorado Springs Signatureâ to happen.
The US Open is not a State or Worlds Qualifier, so doesnât actually fall under the Qualifying Criteria
It wasnât an official VEX IQ or VRC signature event, it doesnât fall under the Signature Event Criteria, which would also require being a world qualifier.
Hi Richard,
The Pikes Peak Robotics Signature Event in Colorado Springs, CO during February 2023 was definitely a REC Foundation event. The REC Foundation approved this event and worked directly with the Event Partner. This event is part of the REC Foundation qualifying criteria. The REC Foundation is absolutely responsible to address any concerns or issues from this event.
The CREATE US Open is not a REC Foundation event. We do not approve this event, organize or directly support the event or provide any qualifying sports. CREATE is a separate organization from the REC Foundation.
Thanks,
Dan
Dan, Sorry you are having to deal with all this nonsense still. Hopefully soon you can get back to the important items on your list like helping my students meet you and @Grant_Cox in Dallas. I suppose you could also tend to that little convention your org is putting on in less than a month in your spare time as well. Good luck & have fun!