Just thought I’d move this discussion here. The main argument saying parking matters is that it is a 12 point swing that takes little time, the main argument against it is that the swing isn’t worth the risk of falling and getting no payoff.
@Mystellianne, to respond to your last post, I respectfully disagree. The skill of your opponent might very well decrease the likely hood of a successful park, but the amount of time you spend trying to park is completely up to you. You can wait for any amount of time, within reason, regardless of if your opponent is parking or not. If you don’t think it’s worth the risk that’s up to you, but in my opinion the point swing is more than enough to decide quite a few matches.
I think the issue will be timing. If you park too early and leave your opposing robot you were “covering” open, what are they doing in the meantime? If they flip two of your flags/caps, you lose 4 points while they gain 4 points while you picked up 6 points for parking. That’s a net gain of 2 points for you and 4 points for them. That means you went to park too early for it to be worth giving up defense.
I see what you’re saying, but parking should only take a few seconds. And in order to match the point swing, three flags have to be turned. That’s two cycles. Do you really think a real robot could aim, shoot, aim, shoot, reload, aim, and shoot all in 5 seconds? My mentality on parking is this: If I don’t, they will. If it ends up taking a long time, don’t do it. But I really don’t think it will take long. If you time it right, it can be a big advantage.
I do see the lines being drawn between the center tile and the high hang from starstruck, and I see the season progressing in the same way. The center tile will be important for early season, and a good way for more points mid season, but I do see it becoming phased out for U.S. open and worlds due to the high cycle times we will see with robots by that time.
I think it all depends on the nature of the bump: if it’s easier to get on than we think then yes it’s a viable source of points if it’s harder than we think it’s probably not worth it.
This honestly seems like a question that varies too much based upon robot design and situational awareness. Ultimately why speculate when you can go start drawing designs taking measurements and testing concepts. Honestly to get up that high a bump quickly, my guess is tank treads well be needed to get up without the assistance of the other parking tiles.
I think it will be harder than it looks to get up there. that is a 3-inch bump, and if an opposing robot is already up there, chances are you’re not going to be able to center park. you would be much better off scoring caps and flags. but, in the case that you have to opportunity to be the first on the center platform, you have to decide if the opponents can score enough points in the time it takes to park that your bonus gets cancelled out. it will all come down to match variety imo
after like 20 minutes of looking around, the platform pipe is 2 inches high which would make the middle platform like 3.75 - 4.25 inches, the range stemming from the possibility of the platforms not being stacked directly on top of each other
are you sure? I’m 99% sure that all of the pipes are 3 inches tall…
But the flags that are being flipped are already scored for you, so turning 2 flags results in an 8 point swing. That means 1 cycle is worth more than a park, and will certainly take less time. That being said, there isn’t really any reason you couldn’t park with 2 balls and then shoot, so that complicates the question a bit.
i mean, the specs for height aren’t in the manual but on
platform pipes are sold as
- 2" x 16" Yellow Platform Pipes
(4) 2" x 16" Blue Platform Pipes
(4) 2" x 16" Red Platform Pipes
and i looked up how these specs are labeled and 2’’ is diameter
the extra length to push the 16 inch to the 20+ inch length and width comes from the corner connector pieces
Appendix A says 2.4" tall for each
huh. I was wrong then
yeah, i see it now, i was wrong too, 2.4’’ height for the alliance platform, and the diameter is also denoted as 2.4’’ but the actual middle platform is 4.9’’ so im assuming that an extra 0.1 inch appears because of the base
all in all, they can be rounded to 2.5’’ alliance and 5’’ middle for easier calculations
vex does still sell 5’’ wheels, not sure if they are legal, but even with those, it’s gonna be tough to get straight up to the center without an assist
also, G12 is waived when it comes to the center platform so does this mean a robot on the floor can potentially push a robot sideways off the platform if they have full omnis without penalty? what about with something more violent such as a puncher?
I think that the center parking space is too many points to just ignore, especially if the opponent could just drive up in the last second or two for 6 free points.
That’s very true, it’s sort of like a Prisoner’s Dilemma. The longer both teams wait to go to the parking zone, the more incentive each team has to go. But by going, you’re putting yourself at a disadvantage in regards to caps and flags. I think this means that eventually, the bonus will come down to whoever can get there fast enough and defend it for the last few seconds of a match
i think what people are saying is to fight for it but only within the last 5-7 seconds so that the other team cant counter by flipping multiple caps or something
side question: are you allowed to drive up the opponent’s alliance platform?
That post was assuming the center parking points are also swing points as I said earlier. If you don’t center park, your opponent will, and if you do, they won’t. Under this assumption, (and it is an assumption I grant you that) by parking you deny 6 and at the same time score 6, with a net swing of 12. In caps that means flipping three caps on posts (3 cycles) and in flags that means toggling three flags (2 cycles assuming you don’t miss).
Your math doesn’t work. What you’re saying is that by you center parking you are also preventing them from parking on their own platform.