Shooting caps


#1

So I had an idea of instead of knocking stacked caps off with a bar rather shoot the cap off. I had seen other robots do it and I looked inside of the rule books prior to see if there was anything on the topic, and there wasn’t. So the story begins at the forest hills qualifier in PA (Team 16101z) where we did not shoot the caps nor did anyone there off until our semi finals match. At the match the team had scored 3 stacked caps so I attempted to shoot the one off and it didn’t knock it off just wiggle it the refs didn’t tell me to stop or give me a warning. So I went back at it again and I shot the one cap off both the ball and cap landed inside of the field and we failed to park but our alliance partner center parked so the final score was 22 to 8 us. However the ref then went to explain that we were disqualified for knocking the cap off the post . Saying that it was his competition and that it was stated in the safety rules. So we then searched the safety rules and it said nothing like that. So we brought it back to him and i showed him the official rules and said that I understood it was his competition. But we had been given no warning and that this didn’t happen at the competition so we didn’t know until that match ended or that we weren’t allowed and asked for a rematch with the new information. His response was that he didn’t have to give us a warning inside of the match and that his rule was final. So is shooting caps not allowed or is it? Also what do you think we should do going forward?


#2

Look at 2:32

shooting caps off poles is kinda dangerous, and while it is a smart idea, I would put a descoring arm on instead


#3

I would think about the time difference between getting a ball, driving into position and knocking off a cap vs driving up to the post and descoring first. Then I would avoid wasting time on shooting caps.


#4

You shot a ref in the face and shot a ball into the crowd my friend. That’s not safe whatsoever and against the first rule


#5

Yeah from the event we may take a cap flipper off to make 1 but we didn’t have the motors and also where the cap was I shot towards me.


#6

There’s a Q&A stating explicitly that it’s illegal. I can go find it if I need to.


#7

You’d think that hitting a ref in the face with a ball might be worth mentioning… If you’re gonna complain and tell the story, at least mention the whole story. Also, it states in the safety rules that any action that a ref deems unsafe is punishable by disqualification, enforced by common sense. I believe that not hurling hard projectiles at an unsuspecting audience would be considered common sense.


#8

Yeah that shot was unintentional and it bounced off of the cap but moving forward we will most likely replace the cap flipper to a descorer or not worry about stacked flags but my main thing is why was it not said after the first shot . None the less we will be moving forward just wanted to get information.


#9

Look at rule s1, sg7, and sg8. Three rules on the topic. oh and sg8 was made for this exact reason


#10

We only looked at the rule book mostly and with quick search in forums we couldn’t find one but nice to know.


#11

Yeah s1 is for the refs and we did look into sg7 whenever we looked into it seemed legal so how would we know if it was illegal after the first shot? As for SG8 it is the same we did not intentionally have the ball nick the cap and also we weren’t given a warning . I also made this post to see if anyone else had encountered shooting flags, again just trying to find out information for the next game.


#12

You just said you were trying to descore it and now saying it wasn’t intentional. All I’m saying is that it was in the rules that you read clearly that it wasn’t allowed


#13

That was when the cap got nicked and also didn’t hit him in the face although I wasn’t looking my drive team was and it grazed him and we didn’t shoot towards the crowd again this was unintentional and goes back to the point of why weren’t we told in the match? Also I only created this post to see if other people had encountered the same way we did.


#14

You hit him square in the face :joy: not grazed


#15

The Descoring was intentional however the ball knicking and going outside of the field was not our goal.


#16

That’s kind of going to happen when you shoot a ball toward an unprotected perimeter. That would probably fall under the Common Sense rule.

I can’t stress enough how important it is to read the Q&A thoroughly. I was given a warning at an event that cost me points. I was warned against my ram, but it was totally legal. I made sure to look it up, and now I carry that Q&A posting with me to my events to make sure I can justify my actions as legal.


#17

The Q&A is at https://www.robotevents.com/VRC/2018-2019/QA/197
It is explicitly illegal.


#18

Yes moving forward were going to look into Q&A alot more definitely would be more help identifying rules instead of the rule book in some cases . Aswell we have practiced alot with shooting caps and never has it flown out however in the heat of the moment the aim must have been a tad off for the nick and during the match I had apologized not knowing I hit him until I was told but again this post was just made to see how other teams had encountered and if it was illegal.


#19

Thank you for the information


#20

Yeah I was on the drive team, the ball did hit the ref in the face though it was obviously unintentional. We talked to the ref afterward and apologized, and he said he was fine. As for the second ball we shot, it didn’t go into the crowd it actually did hit the cap it was meant for. We were mostly just upset that we weren’t given a warning or allowed a rematch after everything. We really should’ve looked into the Q&A more carefully though before attempting it, and we see now where the ref was coming from. We only made this post to get info as to whether the move was/wasn’t illegal, and we know now we were in the wrong. Thanks