Team Dynamic Problems

Chit-Chat / Rumor Mill
22

Yes, thank you for putting that into words. I might actually print this thread and show it to my team.

23

We had a lot of success this ( last now?) year, and I want to continue that. I just want to make sure we don’t have any comradery issues with new team additions. Thanks again for such great wording.

24

While I agree with your points (very well stated), I do believe splitting drivers between skills and match play does present some advantages.

  1. less stress on an individual driver during practice time and during competitions
  2. if one chokes or has a bad day, the other is unaffected. ex) we do skills run in the morning, skills driver chokes all 3 runs and gets depressed, but tournament play isn’t affected because its a different driver and vice versa
  3. drivers can work together to give each other tips and improve precision and skill together
  4. in the extreme situation where one driver gets sick or cant come to a comp, the other can cover and you aren’t completely screwed
25

I think when a driver “chokes” or has an “off day”, they are really just not good at handling the pressure (which goes back to what @mvas was saying). They might be the best driver on a calm practice field, but they might be unable to keep that high level in a competition. That might make them coincidentally have “off days” at every competition.

26

I would say the biggest things that hurt dynamics are:

  • Different levels of dedication
  • People not following through
  • Too many people wanting one role on a team(normally driving)
  • People getting distracted or distracting others

The things that help dynamic would be:

  • Hanging out outside of meetings(sounds basic but makes things better)
  • starting each meeting with a plan
  • Deciding one driver early
  • Knowing that everyone on the team either wants to grind for worlds or slack off
27

I don’t completely agree with that. While it is true that sometimes people will not do so well under pressure, they can still “have an off day” if they are a bit sick or just did not sleep well the night before.

28

if they were consistently choking at every comp or if there’s a pattern to their choking then yes, it’s no longer choking and its either the robots fault or the driver is just bad. But we’re humans, we don’t perform at our peak every day. Some days will be bad, some will be good, whether we like it or not. And it’s not always necessarily pressure or nerves that cause them to have a bad day. It could be personal events happening outside of robotics that’s subconsciously distracting them.

29

I suppose, but a truly elite driver should have no “off day” imo. Again, only for truly elite. That’s my criteria, no real room for error there. I understand slight variance, but there shouldn’t be much difference between peak and low point.

30

Imo, a driver should be able to build and code, so that they can understand the robot and suggest mechanical changes, as well as software changes. It gives them greater control over the robot as a result

31

Communication is one of the biggest things in my opinion. I’ve had problems with this all year; for example, one reoccurring argument within teams at our school was about different sizes of sprockets. I, a freshman, was arguing that the smaller 18t sprockets are stronger than the 24t sprockets at intaking cubes since they have a smaller radius, and vice versa with the 24t sprockets being faster. The seniors and others that were much smarter than me and had taken many physics classes were arguing that I was wrong. However, what was really happening, was that we were arguing about the same things. I am right, that sprockets with smaller radiuses (or radii or something grammar idk) are easier on the intake motors when bringing in cubes, but at the time, I was explaining my side horrifically :grimacing:. Really we were both right, and it was poor communication on my part that was the source of the argument. There should be no discussion hands down on which sprocket size is stronger. Obviously, it works like torque, the larger radius sprockets are faster but weaker, and the smaller radius sprockets are slower but more powerful, in simple terms. It was not the case, that we have a bunch of dumb seniors, but instead because I’m a freshman, and am not yet good with highly technical discussions and good communication. Also, I was a team captain in middle school for 2 years, and this year was my first year where I was not the most experienced person on my team. I had to learn communication skills the hard way.
The things I recommend that have helped me this year:

  • Drawings are most of the time an effective and easy way of communicating an idea.
    -HOWEVER, there is one thing about this. It depends on the idea, but I found that if my drawings were not PERFECT, it did cause some discussion about how it would be built. So I leave you with this: a), don’t make your drawings as accurate to the real thing as possible, and b), only use drawings to explain CONCEPTS, not ways to actually BUILD that concept. When I tried to use drawings as my only source of information on an idea and used them to explain ways to build things as well as concepts, it did not turn out well.

  • If you are not a good drawer, I recommend learning CAD, as CAD can actually show ways to build a part of the robot. This next part varies by team: You should start with a simple drawing to show your concept. When your team captain still is questioning the idea, move to CAD and show him/her exactly how to build the idea, and apply the concepts from your drawing. show him/her how these concepts are applied. My team captain this year would not accept concepts only. he wanted to know how things would actually be built on the robot, not just how they work. This is good, as I would not recommend starting from scratch on a new idea and adding your first prototype straight onto the robot.

These are the recommendations I have for anyone with the same issues. Hope this helps!

32

Side note to the thread: the reason 24t sprockets are faster is because of the larger radius, but you were missing the fact that a larger radius creates a larger tangential velocity for a given angular velocity (for most intakes 200 rpm).

33

also IMO, (before I get this thread off track :joy:) you are totally right. the driver should also be the most committed person on the team. The driver should know the robot down to the screw, and exactly how it functions. every robot has its kinks that are unique to that robot, and so there are often many things that require specific ways of driving or specific buttons/functions that do things to make that robot work at its fullest. these specific kinks are usually only known to the one that built the robot. The driver should not be that one person who claims he/she’s the best driver and, thought they might be the best natural driver, knows nothing about how the robot was built or coded.(Yes, that is a thing, some people are naturally better at driving than others, people are different…). The best drivers are always very involved in the building and programming of the robot, if not they are the main builders. I have seen many amazing teams that consist of two people that are super tight, where one person is the driver AND main builder, while the other is an insanely smart programmer. (2114x…7k…)

This is practically the criteria for who should be the driver on the team, unless this person doesnt want to drive; its all up to team preference in the end, and who is interested in what area of STEM.

34

We have a team of 3, and we work really well with each other. We all talk outside of VEX about random stuff. Our team has been friends for a while, so we decided to split off of our old team of 5 last year and move to just us 3. Personally, I have a struggle that I have been trying to get over for soooooo long. I have a lot of trust issues. It’s sometimes super hard to deal with because It makes me feel like a super control freak and I don’t like it. I think it is because when something needs done, I instantly visualize it exactly how it should be done, and my mind just instantly wants to do it exactly the way I visualized it. Don’t get me wrong, I still am open to all of my other teammates’ opinions, suggestions, ect. This isn’t just in VEX either, It is in almost everything I do. Trust issues in a team are horrible, I’m here to tell you. I hate that I am like that and I wish I could stop it, but it’s really hard. Earlier in the year one of my teammates asked me if she could learn to program, and of course I said yes, but I never actually took an incentive to teach her. I think this is because of my trust issues because I am so used to being the one doing almost everything that I can’t imagine not doing something. I do building, programming, and driving at my house. When we are at school practices, it is usually either one teammate notebooking and the other helping me build something or him resetting the robot/field when I am programming. I just feel like I am being so selfish and mean to my teammates when I am doing all of this, but at the same time I want it done quick and done right.

Thank you for coming to my TED talk

35

Maybe you could try quality control. Just inspect every part that your teammates make and make sure they are up to standards.

36

here are the biggest team dynamic problems I have seen in the past:

  • different levels of commitment in terms of time and focus
  • lack of communication and understanding amongst all members
  • major discrepancies in distribution of work
  • people with overlapping roles i.e. driving + programming
  • time management issues
  • lack of directive
  • being unable to compromise + integrate multiple ideas/perspectives
37

Sorry if this is a bit of a ramble :slight_smile:

My team’s main problem this year was a lack of communication about what we were doing and that resulted in one person (mostly me, but not always) inadvertently monopolizing the design decisions for the robot. We did manage to resolve the problem, but it took a lot of talking and some apologies.
The other problem I have had in years past was discussions about designs and the like just turning into fights instead of being constructive. I can’t really remember how we resolved those other than just waiting for everyone to calm down.
As general advice to keep these kinds of problems, mine would be: make sure everyone is in the loop and communicating, watch for problems in the team dynamic (like pointless arguments) and be ready to point them out, and most importantly, apologize when you know you’ve done something wrong.

38

This one is easy, what we do is have scrimmages during practice. You get 3 matches in a row against different opponents. Have someone count the amount of points that you score, this is doesn’t count your alliance partner or autonomous. Average the score, have the robot rest, get fresh batteries, and do this again for every driver and/or pair. The highest average score is the winner. We even had matches so close that sometimes someone won by like 1 point.

Now during the tournament, we have 1st string and 2nd string. Tournaments usually have 7 matches so 1st string gets 4 and 2nd string gets 3. At the end of the 7 matches, the team goes over notes and discuss who performed the best. If there is a tie, the coach makes the call.

39

You want to avoid having member of the team fall in love with the robot. Our team had trouble with this this season. A member of our team grew fond of our robot so they started an intimate relationship with it. We all thought it was odd but we let the relationship continue until it escalated. I don’t want to go into details but their behavior with the robot was not appropriate so we had to kick him off the team. After the traumatic event, we don’t think we will continue our team.

40

How gosh 2020202020202020

41

While important, I don’t think this is a very common issue. Do continue your team though; you shouldn’t let one person stop you from learning.