Scoring of a pass at the end of the match with no additional goals

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1

We had a debate tonight including several judges, coaches, and teacher. In the scenario below does the final pass get scored? Keep in mind this is Elementary so it’s completely possible that this can happen.

  1. Match starts
  2. Team 1 picks up a ball 1 and scores (1 goal + 1 switch)
  3. Both teams struggle moving their bots and don’t touch either ball again
  4. Ball 2 sits sadly in a corner getting no love
  5. With 4 seconds left, Team 2 with a broken wheel manages to tap ball 1 and it gently rolls over to Team 1 touching both.

The rules don’t specify any order of operations needed to score a pass BUT all of the examples end with a goal, not a pass. SC5 also states “An Alliance receives credit for a Pass once both Robots independently contact a Ball before it is Scored or leaves the Field.” The “Before it is scored or leaves the field” would seem to indicate that something needs to happen to the ball after the pass for it to count.

I have gone through the rules and Q&A. I’ve found close but not quite matches on Q&A BUT if the scenario has been answered please send a link - don’t just say to Google it. There’s a lot of “SC5 is clear” answers but if it was we wouldn’t have had multiple judges with different takes on the rule.

Below is a quick summary of SC5, SC6, and SE1-6.

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SC5A - Both robots have to touch the ball but not at the same time.
SC5B Ball resets when loaded
SC5C One pass per ball per load in loading station
SC5D Rapid load at start does = no pass
SC5E Preload in teamwork counts as a max of 1 pass (i.e. preload + “n”passes = 1 pass)
Note for C&D if unsure, give the kids the pass during rapid loading
Q&A - Ball doesn’t need to fly, landing station during rapid is good for pass, preload is good for pass, only 1 pass per load

SC6 Can not have more passes than goals
SC6A Switches cleared determines pass point value
SC6B Record all the passes and trust the app is right
SC6C Exception to everything - if no switches, you can still get 4 points for passing.

SE1 - ends in goal
SE2 - ends in goal
SE3 - ends in goal
SE4 - ends in goal
SE5 - same as 4 except for loading area - ends in goal
SE6 - ends in “Robot B retrieves and scores it again” aka ends in goal

2 Likes
2

This 100% should be a Q and A question. That is for sure a way to make sure they clarify it. In the meantime, it is up to the head ref at the competition to tell if it is rather counted as a pass or not. Also you should post this to the Q and A because this would be very helpful for many teams and refs.

3

Thanks, I am a coach but for some reason my team wasn’t showing up when I registered so I couldn’t complete the account in order to post. I’ll try again but I might need someone else to post over there.

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4

I see the nuance you are asking about.

SC7 indicates the game is scored in real time, so you should count the pass as it happens.

SC5 indicates that a pass is when both robots contact the ball before it is scored or leaves the field

The gap is if a ball never is scored or leaves the field is it still considered a pass? My read of the rules (which doesn’t count, you should ask Q&A) is that the SE4 explanation applies, since the match ended in this moment, the pass does not count.

5

Shouldn’t this count? One ball one pass. The rules don’t specify I believe when they half to happen or that it has to be the same cycle. Similar situations have happened to us where we have per say 6 balls 5 passes and the other swish gets a buzz beater pass. In these situations, they’ve counted the pass.

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