Why 7 MS divisions?

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Would it not be fairer to have 8 division champions advancing to the overall elimination bracket? Otherwise, one alliance would get a buy? Or am I missing something?

Only the alliance that is ranked first is the one that gets to skip the first round. This determines how the alliances are ranked:

  1. Average points accumulated by all Teams in a Division during their Qualification Matches
  2. Average points accumulated by the winning Alliance in Qualification Matches
  3. Total Autonomous Win Points by all Teams in a Division during their Qualification Matches
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Where did you find the information that there will be 7 divisions?

The information is in the new game manual update released two days ago.
I’ll link it here for your reference.

2021-VRC-GameManual3.0.pdf (vexrobotics.com)

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The physical set up at Dallas provides enough space for pits and fields for 10 Divisions of teams. For the first competition, we allocated 6 Divisions to VEX MS, 2 Divisions for VEXU and 2 Divisions for JROTC National Championship. Based on accepted invites for JROTC and the very large waitlist for VRC MS, we reduced the size of the JROTC Division (by adding more JROTC teams to this one division) and added a 7th VRC MS division. We do understand 8 Divisions works better but that was not possible. We determined having the odd division size was worth it so that more VRC MS teams could compete at the 2022 VEX Robotics World Championship.

Best Regards,

Dan

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Thanks! I was hoping to find the number of divisions for Vex IQ, but I don’t see that in the Pitching In game manual.

Does anyone know the number of divisions for Vex IQ?

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Is it really worth it, though? Isn’t it better to keep the integrity of the Championship by maybe limiting waitlist invites to just teams that did well in skills or won an award instead of allowing over 100 MS teams in just because they put their name on the waitlist?

Apparently it is worth it. I trust Dan has the best interests of the integrity and sustainability of the RECF VRC program at heart.

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I think that World should be limited to just the two Country / State / Regional Champions and the Excellence Award winners. That would allow

  1. Make Worlds more exclusive, that will make teams try harder next year
  2. More plays for the obviously stronger teams - more plays makes it easier for the truly top teams to rise to the top of the alliance selection.
  3. Make alliance selection to the top 16 alliances, this will make scouting and team alliances more important and almost make them political.
  4. Run the quarter finals as B01, but the semi and the finals as B03 because we want to just showcase those top 8 teams to really inspire other teams to work hard.
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I don’t know, that might still let in some teams that aren’t really that strong. World’s should be limited to teams that have won both their Country / State / Regional Championship and a Signature event. That way, there’s no need to even bother with Qualification Rounds and we go right into BO1 Eliminations so we can get to the really important part - the release of the official VRC Water Game 2022-2023!

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I can’t help but strongly disagree with this for the following reasons:

  1. Some regions are incredibly stronger than others. This will cause an extreme discrepancy in the skill level of teams that are qualifying for worlds, and in some RCs, worlds qualifying for some of the best teams a matter of luck.
  2. One of the best aspects of worlds is that it is a large and exciting event. Reducing the number of qualified teams would take away this experience.
  3. Worlds is an amazing experience for thousands of participants that should be expanded to as many top teams as possible.
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I could get behind the Signature Events, but I think they should raise the price of them to at least $500 per team. That would give the event more money for things like indoor fireworks, massage chairs for drivers, etc.

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my bolding

How do we know that the team on the Wait list is an ordinary team and not just an unlucky team?

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I like this plan but after the teams have finished the finals, we have one more round and have the same finalist teams play BO3 BUT the the mentors/adults drive and run robot….and that winning team is the Champion

Other alternative have Dan fly to all events and hand pick the best adult driven/designed robot team and have a 16team adult drive only World Championship

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When I ran the local Pinewood Derby Champs we had an adults only league, only rule was you had to use the wheels and follow the weight. We had some amazing adult cars with carbon fiber bodies, springs for suspensions, wild paint jobs (one was mirror finish chrome) Pretty cool.

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Here’s some food for thought:

  • What about regions like Singapore and Finland, where this season they had skills only nationals event swithout judging, so in this case there would be no excellence award winners/tournament champions to speak of.

  • Also what about other regions like New Zealand which for the past 2 seasons have had 2 separate nationals events each season due to the COVID pandemic. Since they have 2 separate champion alliances and excellence award winners, who would get the berths to worlds?

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We don’t, but RECF does. They can look at awards, match stats, skills rankings, etc. I know a coach who put all 5 of their teams on the waitlist (1 ultimately earned a Worlds spot and the other 4 got invites from the waitlist). Not all of those teams are Worlds level teams. The coach just likes the prestige of having all their teams go to Worlds. Teams should have to, at least someway, earn their spot at a Championship event for that event to be legitimate.

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Good point, I think that in a case where there is only skills they can transfer the top three skills to their champion / excellence slots.

Of course the Kiwi’s can come with both the last year and this years teams. And I think that should be the “RoboCatz Addendum” - If a team can not attend a World event due to travel restrictions or finances they can be awarded a slot for the next years Worlds. This would let them get travel stuff sorted. This would help teams like from Turkey where visa’s are a problem. In the case of the NZ teams they both just get to come that year. Remember with more space there is some flexibility to cater to the top teams now that the squarebots won’t be there.

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What I was trying to convey is that each season there have been 2 separate nationals event. For Change Up, there was 1 per island, and this season there were Saturday and Sunday events.

But as for the general idea of your proposal, sure it will limit the number of teams at worlds, but sometimes the teams that aren’t so good at their regional championships do very well at Worlds (ex: 400S, who was ranked 43rd at their regional championship yet went on to win the 2016 VRC Championship & 7405P who did not win their regional championship yet also went on to win the 2019 VRC World Championship).

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I’m not trying to be rude, but have you been to WORLDS? Especially for IQ, I always tell my parents and kids that you are going to see some of the best and worst performances from around the world. I had a team once that was paired with 7 “clawbot” bots out of their 10 matches.

If they really wanted a “best bot” contest, they would just take the top teams off of the skills list. It’s not just about being the best, it’s an inspirational event for students of all levels.

And I have never been at a WORLDS event that didn’t feel very legitimate. The teams that prevail are truly remarkable.

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