Here is the link to the new/updated training video series CAD for VEX Robotics Using Onshape.
Level 1 - Setting up an Onshape account
Level 2 - Getting around in Onshape
Level 3 - Building a robot from a CAD model
Level 4 - Connecting parts
Level 5 - Official VEX V5 Parts Library
Feedback is welcome!
All good stuff, IF YOU ONLY HAD CURRENT PARTS AVAILABLE!!! Iâve asked VEX, and no one maintaining a sanctioned Onshape library (yet). But I found IQ Competition Products - Products - IQ - VEX Robotics, which is the VEX parts catalog, and each object has a download. I pulled the âRack Gear & Pinion (276-2184-003).stepâ and had the assembly in Onshape in a couple minutes.
Iâd show images, but I donât think I can pasteâŚ
The problem is you ONLY want to change from the library what was deleted or added. And then, there needs to be an owner of this task for currancy (I assert at VEX).
I think VEX should maintain, because theyâre already maintaining the CAD files and are offering online. CAD is a huge engineering field, especially as you get into simulation, and Onshape excels at that as weil. Because of browser base, and educational license, Onshape becomes the âno brainerâ for teaching STEM, but it really needs the VEX library as the base⌠Please help rally the cry for assistance⌠Jerry Palardy, youâre the best!! Iâve passed on your youTubes to lots who have been considering⌠thanks.
I have no idea where you got the idea that nobody is maintaining a sanctioned Onshape library. Onshape has their own library that was updated as recently as February 2023 and while it doesnât contain super recent items like 5.5w motors or the new anti static traction wheels it does contain flywheel weights, ball bearings, 6p chain, and other somewhat new items. I also would suspect that the missing items that will be added soon. If you want access to this library there is a youtube link here that guides you through the whole process that i found after a quick google search. As you stated though for the new items you can download the from vexâs website and import them into Onshape to use them which isnât very hard.
I started at On Shape, and they agreed they donât âownâ public library maintenance. They did think Vex should be segregated out, and MOVED the library they had, so âupdatedâ might be a stretch. AND, if they is the VEX path, where is the basic doc (in VEX) for how to find libraries of CAD parts (on all vendors).
As you mentioned âdownloadâ, I downloaded ALL the V5 STEP files (from VEX link) into OnShape today, so I have what VEX might assert is current. But ironically, the winch and pulley kit (276-1546) isnât there (first example) and the bolts for pulley arenât included, which become apparent trying to use the kit (second example).
If anyone getting into 2023, and want CAD, Iâm more than happy to share the libraryâŚ
Weâve got kids as young as 9 who are very comfortable âplayingâ with CAD, but not when they have to do more than assemble parts⌠Need the KISS principle applied for themâŚ
As stated, VEX should own the content (i.e, add/delete/fix sub-assemblies) of the global Onshape tree of CAD files. But that doesnât seem in the cards.
So, Iâve pull the entire CAD tree from the VEX Product web page, for IQ, EXP and VR5 product CAD libraries into a tree. Since âin or outâ of a completion group, there is a folder for each class of competition. Both those allowed and forbidden can be found, so user be ware.
Now to figure out how to make this the global public tree, but Iâd be happy to share with anyone interested.
Could you share the VEX V5 library with me? I just started using CAD. Thank you!
Paul is challenging the status quo! Good for you! Youâve got some good suggestions, but there are reasons behind some of the things you find frustrating.
Regarding updates to the Onshape library. Onshape maintains the Official Library, but not always quickly. Maybe they can assign this to a summer intern? Paul - Iâm not sure what you meant regarding Onshape not owning public library maintenance or that they moved it. For instance, when I look at the version history of the âVEX V5 - Structureâ parts document, I see that it was updated by an Onshape employee on Feb 13, and among other things, the 15x30 base plate was added. Perhaps you were referring to the location of the STEP files on the VEX website? If thatâs not it, then give me more details.
Since my original post, Onshape has released a âVex V5 Part Libraryâ application. It is available from the Onshape App Store and is free. It is still in beta, but it makes getting parts way easier. This will be intuitive for users that have no CAD experience and donât know anything about a parts library and all the work that goes into it (that every user used to have to go through back in the dayâŚ).
However, there are some things that the app canât do yet, so for the time being, creating a label from the official parts lib is still recommended.
For new parts. We should create a âNew Partsâ library and show users how to add that to their parts label. This would be temporary to supplement the official lib until new parts are added there.
Onshape has to prioritize which parts get included in the official parts lib. Of course, we users want everything now. And everything may be on the list, but some of the lower priorities get cut. It seems like rack gears should have been a higher priority.
Onshape does a thorough job with the official library. For instance, they ensure all the materials of each part are correct so that assembly weight and center of gravity calculations are accurate. The omni wheels in their library wonât break apart into thousands of pieces when you try to copy and paste them. They also work to make things configurable, making it possible to change the size of a screw within an existing assembly in a few clicks. Programming within Onshape is required for those configuration options. Although Onshape programming is not super complicated, you really need to know Onshape to do it quickly and correctly. Granted, most students are not going to be doing any center-of-gravity calculations, but I can still see why Onshape would want the official parts library to be professional, and that is not as simple as importing the latest STEP files.
VEX ownership of CAD artifacts is tricky. VEX should definitely own the step files, and they do. Parts libs for specific CAD apps are different. For one thing, VEX may not have the right people to support any given CAD app. Whereas an Onshape employee should know how to optimize a parts library for performance. Also, Autodesk (makers of many CAD apps, including Fusion 360 and Inventor) is a big sponsor of VEX, and so is PTC (makers of Onshape). VEX canât show favoritism to one or the other, and supporting all CAD apps would be a never-ending task.
DavidW, to share, I need to locate you in the OnShape system. I think an e-mail will work.
jrp62, I understand the challenges of NOT favoring any vendor, but in the process, the teams all lose, because theyâre all too afraid to say anything. If youâre right about PTC/Onshape and Autodesk (owners of the majority of the market), it shouldnât be as hard as it is to find the reference libraries for the parts (for a particular competition per year). Google search is of no use for this.
Iâm hoping to get middle school kids into the idea of âparts assembliesâ. So things like the âgrab armâ could be defined on day one, and one team member could use OnShape to explore the implementation options (from library) without even buying one part, then brainstorm in the Team on the best approach to move forward. Looking at 2023 VRC, I already envision a component with a half dozen solutions to explore.
This task (with an effective library) is far easier than creating a new wheel.
So, if Onsphape (and others) do keep up with the annual libraries of âpermissibleâ parts for Competition, how about posting the URLs for us all to review. Besides CAD vendors, OnShape should also promote those who are teaming with current libraries for each year. As far as Iâd gotten from OnShape, theyâd only committed to segregate a global handle for VEX, without any structure for different years or completion levels.
And if JRP is short for Jerry Palardy, I must commend you for your YouTube efforts. They are well segmented, paced with breaks, and dozens of useful links all over. For other reading this, Jerry dedicated his time to MANY training YouTubes for OnShape, which I still consider the easiest to get started with CAD, now that weâve gotten out of the pandemic with almost everyone having Chromebooks and decent network speeds.
While I know you want an officially supported CAD library for all vendors, in the mean time the community does have well maintained libraries for both Inventor and Solidworks available:
@PaulW - Yes @jrp62 = Jerry Palardy = Coach Palardy. I appreciate your support of the video series. Glad to hear that they are useful.
A few years ago, when I first attempted to get my VEX teams to use CAD, I brought in a CAD expert to show the kids how itâs done. (Truth be told, although I like working in CAD, I have no professional experience). This guy had done VEX in high school and now used CAD on the job daily. He really knew his stuff and spent an hour showing the kids all about SolidWorks. The only thing he didnât show them was a VEX robot. When asked if he could show us a VEX model, he said something like, âWell, I need to make some updates to my VEX parts library, they are on my other computer, but I can have it ready in a few days.â Wait, whatâŚ?
Seems like you have the same impression of the current parts libraries. And I thought we had made progress. 
As far as I know (and I could be wrong), Onshape is the only CAD app with an official VEX parts library maintained by the company. For all others, the users create and maintain the parts libs. Protobot does have a built-in parts lib, but the app itself is maintained by a user/users; there is no company.
This works when those users are enthusiastic about keeping the libraries updated. However, what frequently happens is that those users move on and no longer support it. Iâm guessing that companies donât maintain the parts lib because they canât make money from it, plus the users are already taking care of it.
Anyway, it would be nice if the parts libs were complete and updated promptly. If there were a way of monetizing that task, it would happen more quickly. Having libraries for a particular competition year is a good idea. In Onshape, it may be possible to do this with the versioning features. The Onshape parts lib is already versioned, but you would need to be able to search by a version name. Something I havenât tried myself.
VEX does release new parts in the middle of the competition year, so minor versions would be needed. I am not sure how often VEX makes discontinued parts illegal, but that would have to be taken into account too. Removing parts from the lib brings challenges to existing models, should be manageable, albeit confusing.
There might be a misunderstanding about what the current Onshape parts lib actually is. Using searching and labeling allows you to find and insert VEX parts quickly. But Onshape is doing more than just providing a label or global handle. Each document returned in a search for âOfficial VEX V5 Libraryâ is a section of the parts library that Onshape created. And someone worked to create each of those. You can open and view any of them, your label has the URLs to them. For instance here is the URL for Sprockets and Chains. I believe that the parts lib is divided into multiple documents to improve performance. It might also have to do with providing more flexibility with versioning and releasing updates. As previously mentioned there is a new âVEX V5 Parts Libraryâ application. That is not trivial; a lot of work went into it. However, if users do not see the value in that, then Onshape will not continue to support it.
Back to the original problems you identified⌠The V5 parts lib is incomplete and is missing some new parts and this yearâs field elements. You are also looking for an IQ parts lib, as well as EXP.
For the V5 parts lib, the thing to do is create a supplemental library (or libraries) and show users how to add it to their VEX V5 Parts Label. As those parts get added to the official lib, they are removed from the supplement.
No quick answer for IQ and EXP, but there may be some good longer-term options. I may be wrong, but I donât think many IQ teams are using CAD. The kids doing CAD with IQ are taking a robotics or STEM class, and CAD is a lesson. So coaches with CAD experience will not see the need for a parts lib, whereas educators would. The good news is that educational institutions have budgets to pay for materials to support their curriculum. If an IQ parts lib were part of an educational package, it could be monetized.
Your idea of âparts assembliesâ is interesting too. Similar concept for the drivetrains lib that is out there; feel free to include it. Word of caution; I have noticed that students who start robotics using pre-existing CAD models sometimes think all robot designs or features are pre-existing. Like, just go into Onshape and find what you want to build. Of course, creating something from CAD is what we really want to see. So keep the parts assemblies generic and just use them to teach concepts.
First, apologies to AutoCAD and Dessault. Poor research on my part. They currently own most seats for CAD. But Commerical far different than educational. They all seem to recognize the need for Education, but some do better than others. My requirement is 1) Team model management, 2) support thin client, 3) on at least 95% of possible client technology, 4) scale to support simulation (someday).
I found Onshape the richest support so far, but now need to look at Fusion360 . But i still suspect Onshape the only one that is pure browser base support, which makes entry into CAD far easier.
Because VEX wonât want to endorse just one CAD, the fundamental problem is making the world aware of new models. The solution is easy, if VEX steps up. Ask a sponsor (aka, Google) for donation of an âIntegration Connectorâ broker. This is a Global Pub/Sub persistent messaging service. Then, VEX drops the âshapeâ file and tree location on the broker. ANY vendor (or even team) subscribes and gets the image in a timely manner. Since I suspect they also outsource parts manufacturing, this same technique could be used before the parts are made available publicly to manufacturers.
The CAD vendors do need to do a little work, but would become the âmost currentâ parts provider in CAD, so should be willing to integrate the SHAPE into a single âGlobalâ tree for VEX. (Potential user community 1/2 million)
And, vendors that integrate this technique can say âVEX competition authorized parts listâ. Timeliness today is quite a problem when considering CAD.
My goal is to move Robloxâs users to CAD, so 10 year oldsâ possible. Iâve validated this with my grandson. But that age doesnât have patience to build a part. they will need to work at the macro scale.
My view of the object tree is â/VEX-Robotics/2023/VR5/circular/wheels/â, which mimics almost every online parts supply company. This, and the âshapeâ object the core components of the message, but lots more could be included.
Anyone know a personal connection into VEX to try to work with? If they publish, I suspect the vendors will comeâŚ
My goal? All of us know the periodic table, and why it has the shape it does. Not many now work with the Molecular Orbital Theory. Not everyone is a chemist. Not all will be CAD engineers. But all should be comfortable with technology, and youth should not be the hindrance.
As a high school student who has and is currently working in larger teams of students to make robot models (including for VEX robots), I can say that Fusion should be able to fulfill most of your requirements. Fusionâs team model management can be a bit finicky at times, but using Fusion Teams, should help. While I have been able to run fusion on a school provided chromebook through the cloud, this is a minable workable solution and is not ideal for all use case scenarios. The ideal solution would be for each student to have their own computer (ie windows laptop or desktop) with Fusion downloaded, which is local to the computer, while files are saved on the cloud. Fusion can be run completely through browser, but it is slower than if it is local.
Our team was able to find an unupdated fusion library, which fit its purpose for our needs â to provide a rough geometry for the robot before it is actually built. Something of note is that any CAD software can be used to give a rough shape of a robot (extrude rectangles for drive rails, circles for wheels, making approximate dimensions), which can be used to plan a rough sketch before a robot is built.
I would strongly suggest looking at concept sketches rather than full robots in CAD for your needs. After helping to train students to just get set up in CAD over the past few years, and having the beginning of my CAD experience in middle school, I believe that it is definitely possible for beginning middle school students to CAD if they are inclined, but I believe that rough âconcept sketchesâ are a much more valuable way to introduce CAD to this age group, rather than assembling full robots. Personally, I always start by designing robots with rough sketches on whiteboards, which then get put into CAD as rectangles, cylinders, and simple extruded shapes. I can take these sketches directly begin making prototypes from them, or turn them into more complete/realistic models using actual parts to refine the geometry of what Iâm creating before actually making it.
The other reasons why I would consider this approach are the difficulties of doing complete CAD assembly with vex parts and doing them using an with complete browser-based CAD. Browser based CAD is slow, and has difficulties processing complex assemblies (such as robots). I only have experience with Fusion and TinkerCAD for online CAD based packages, and one day my team (given, this was a CAD team of ~7 students recorded 23 Fusion crashes in one day (6 hours of CAD)).
Another alternative CAD program I would consider would be TinkerCAD, which has collaboration on the same model for teams of students. TinkerCAD would be closest to the CAD for 10 year olds playing Roblox (Iâm not too sure what age group your team is made of, but I am assuming middle school). This software is designed to be much more approachable, so it doesnât have advanced features, but should be more than sufficient for an intro to CAD in robotics. The lower bar to entry for this software should allow more of your team to get involved with CAD, and due to the more simplistic nature of these CAD models, they are more stable and less likely to crash while you are in the middle of working on them.
Aivintle: praise to you for spending time trolling chats, and making thoughtful contributions! You obviously will have a successful career. Get some more Team members to kick in! These forums are for the Team as much as coaches.
Sorry you had experiences with outages. It is no more acceptable in CAD than Banking. You should read this to see where CAD has come in about 20 years:
This is important, because the nation is now being laced with fiber, and schools (with pandemic) made mass distributions of personal computers. The environment is ripe for change.
VEX should NOT be backing any single vendor. But they SHOULD be enabling all of them with things VEX/REC clearly design and change annually. Itâs their job to at least make the âSHAPEâ files available, but much better than you find now on their VEX/VRC product page: Search results for: '' - VEX Robotics
Explained nicely (though a 2020 view): https://vrc-kb.recf.org/hc/en-us/articles/9636477857687-CAD-for-VRC-Teams
To use CAD though, it is imperative to have a COMPLETE and ACCURATE CAD library. Vendors (nor any Team) should be put in the position of chasing âSHAPEâ files. So the solution must start with a VEX/REC (fairly simple) change.
Start with soliciting a sponsor (aka, Google) to contribute an instance of âIntegration Connectorsâ. This is a SaaS Global Persistent Messaging Broker. VEX would need to manage clients (add each to a table) and then put each SHAPE object on the queue to be distributed. VEX really needs to structure the info for competitions, so a tree of SHAPEs (or SHP) files like: /VEX-Robotics/2023/VR5/circular/wheels/2.75 Omni-Directional Wheel - Double Roller (276-1902) .step
This mimics what every auto parts company does to locate parts.
On the CAD vendor side, they subscribe, get notices of these messages and keep their library up to date. Since automated, this provides each vendor with the ability to offer current libraries, with sufficient data to product BOMâs to show judges. And THIS then the base for a rigorous base for CAD design in competition. I know making parts isnât hard, and in fact CAD designed for that. But I donât think anyone has the base measures to know what they extrude in CAD comes close to real measures, so images would be useful for visualization, but useless to validate the design or define the necessary parts list, much less locate the center of mass of the RobotâŚ
Anyone know the contacts in CAD VEX I can work with on this design??