Just wondering if anyone has felt that the high ranking teams at Vex Worlds are mostly Chinese teams. I know there are many non - Chinese teams that are high ranked but many are Chinese.
For example, last year for ITZ, the Middle School Finals Matches had China against China. The High School Matches had China/Canada against Canada/USA. The VexU Matches were China against USA. So out of the 10 teams in the finals, 6 of them were Chinese. After the world champions were determined, 4 out of 5 of them were Chinese, 5225A being the only non - Chinese team.
This year for TP, there was a similar outcome. The MS Finals had China against China/USA. The HS Finals had China against China/USA and VexU had China against USA. Out of the 10 finals teams 7 were Chinese and out of the 5 finalist teams 3 were Chinese.
I’m not trying to target Chinese teams here but it does seem a little strange that there are so many high ranking, world champion Chinese teams. And for some world champion teams, that was their first year even existing. Take team 7671C, Shadowless Chicken, for example, this was their first year ever doing Vex and they won the Middle School world championships. Vex DB Page: https://vexdb.io/teams/view/7671C
I want to know your opinions on this topic.
Build Better Robots.
Look talent does not have boundaries, and certain regions have more teams than others. In this case, China has a lot more VEX teams and sends its very best. The teams work hard on their robots and perform well on the competition field. Singapore has fewer teams, has a culture of excellence and performs well on the competition field. One person teams work hard and perform well on the competition field.
Bottom line, you have to be better than the rest on the field.
I am not sure what’s your main intention of this post… are you trying to find out how their achieved such good results or are you questioning how is it possible that a 1st year vex team can be doing so well?
I am not sure what is the current status over there, but from what I heard, at least few years back, there were many unregistered teams in China. And many unofficial tournaments as well. All these data are not captured in robotevents or vexdb.
The team will only register officially if they think they stand a good chance of making it to worlds, etc.
But as I said, situation could be very different now.
And having some interactions with the China teams, I can vouched that they really spent a lot of time doing their driving practice and programming,
Their robots designs are rarely totally out of the box, but they more than made up for it with their driving skills and programming,
So yes… this is one approach of doing well - basic mechanism, but so well-tuned and so well driven.
I will also agree that there are many teams in China that are not registered teams… If they registered their teams they would get a much higher allotment of the worlds spots and they would REALLY get our attention! So, just because they didn’t exist officially doesn’t mean they are new to VEX.
I’m an international student from China and I’m currently in an USA team. Middle school students in China would probably spend a lot of time working on their robot. High students in China won’t be able to spend that much time because they have to worry about the national college entrance exam (I think that’s the reason why there are less Chinese high school team). I think there are also better and more experienced coaches in China, they can probably teach the students how to design and program the robot (this is just my guess, I’m saying this because I kind of learned everything in a hard way here in a USA team). But no matter what, the team members definitely spend a lot of time on their robot. If you are asking how they get such good results, I would say hardwork is the most important reason.
Along with multiple successful China teams, there are of course many that aren’t as successful as the Einstein teams, it’s just the successful ones gain more recognition.
China is no doubt a growing region. For example, FRC team 6986, finalist on the einstein field made a huge transition from their power up season to deep space. What comes down to this is the amount of time and effort they dedicate into their work.
China has no where near as many spots to worlds as we do in the US, so they send the very best teams to worlds and to be honest, for middle school at least, their robots aren’t even really that legendary or complicated, but they make up for that by driving very good and being excellent at programming, there was a Chinese team in our division that only had a very simple non angle changing puncher and was out there beating all the double shot catapults in basically 2v1 because they had a insanely good auton and driver.
So basically, Chinese teams at worlds are just really good, there is nothing sketchy about it
lol, the creator of this post and I seem to have similar names!
On a serious note, the creation of this post does seem to directly target some of the top Chinese teams. As has been mentioned earlier, there are a number of factors that play into this. Many unregistered teams makes the region look smaller than it is, making Vex give them less spots. Because of this, the very top teams and nothing more advance to Worlds, which means that almost all if not all of the Chinese teams representing at Worlds have extremely high levels of competition.
In short, implying that there is some sort of mega scheme that all Chinese teams are working together to dominate Worlds is not only factually incorrect, but the phenomenon can be explained using simple reasoning.
Okay, I have to say something just to make sure it is understood by all parties:
ALL regions send their very best. When discussing Finialism and such, only the best teams from around the globe are contending.
Yes, larger regions send more of their very best (and those spots occasionally trickle down to the next highest level of teams, which are still very good), but saying that China (and all small regions) can only send “their very best” isn’t a very valid argument.
The only counterargument to that assertion is that smaller regions have more competition for less spots, so they try to produce better products, but I personally believe all teams at that scale put forth their very best effort.
Edit: Sorry to be preach-y, but I just wanted to emphasize (and eliminate) that argument.
China, Singapore, and other similar regions just have very dedicated students and very successful programs for training those students. There is VERY little reason to suspect “foul play” or the equivalent. (But I think we’re all in agreement here about that, and just want to clarify our intentions in such comments.
Probably don’t play Fortnite.
Many teams from China are actually in violation of . More specifically, the only thing that the students on certain teams do is drive the robot. Everything else, including building, coding, even alliance selection is done by adults. I’m lucky to be on a team that actually lets students do all the things. Team 8825S(alliance partner of 5225A and world champion) is a student-centric team and I am acquainted with their leader. He is only champion because he’s really good, I can assure you that. I’m in the same high school (in China) he used to be in and any team number starting with 88825 or 8825 are our school teams. Me and my fellow students do everything ourselves. We decide what kind of bot to build, we build them, we code them and of course drive them. We also get to choose our alliance partners freely. But this is not the case with all Chinese teams. So know that when you’re against Chinese teams, their apparent excellence may not be true.
So my guess is true… That’s quite sad.
Dang, I thought that only happened with some teams, I’ve seen adults control alliance selection from Chinese teams and some things, but I didn’t know the adults went that far in coding and building the robot
I don’t believe all the Chinese students and teachers are like that. If I stayed in China for high school I would never let my coach do everything for me.
not all Chinese teams are like that.
One of my incentives for posting about this topic was from my coach. While we were working on our robot in our pit or practicing on the fields he would go and talk with some of the other teams’ coaches. He told us that in some of the Chinese teams he talked to, the coaches made most of the decisions. The students have no control over their alliance partner etc.
I highly doubt all Chinese teams are like this as there were some very friendly Chinese teams that we had a great time with.
I agree, the Chinese teams we were with during qualifications knew what they were doing
It is regrettable your coach shared this negative opinion and more so to have a resulting thread on the forum that casts shade. As for coaches making decisions for teams, it does happen even with US teams, it is not “student-centered” approach that the RECF has in mind for VRC.
Well of course not, read the post sarah was replying to. The thing is, a lot of them are, which is way too many.