Some teams have already gotten their hands on a push back field. In the most recent Luke video, it highlights some of the poorly designed mechanics of the game elements. When I was watching the game get revealed, I thought that this year was going to be super fun. however, after watching some of the videos of just descoring by ramming the robot into the goals, onto balls rolling out in the match load, and when scoring the ball just rolling out, I feel disappointment. It is like the GDC didn’t even test any of the elements.
Another thing I am worried about is the field just breaking. The metal of the goal is one of the flimsyest I have ever seen. and on the top, it is literally just poly. I am from singapore, and I would probably take like a month just to get replacements if like a goal broke.
overall, seeing the mechanincs and design of the materials, I am pretty concerned and deeply disappointed.
Yeah agreed, it really doesn’t appear that they tested it all that much considering the blocks roll out of the match loader when dropped. Descoring is far too easy and will punish teams for parking. A lot of issues, hope the gdc can resolve them but who knows.
Every year, the new game has one problem everyone likes to act will be the end of the game. Remember how concerned people were with the support of the ladder in high stakes just for it to be a small inconvenience at worst. I think we need to let the game develop a bit, and then we will see how prevalent these issues end up being. This is not to say your concern is worth nothing, but I think this years game will work out just as fine as years prior.
genuinely incredibly disappointed in GDC this year, these issues could be easily fixed with a rubber or other high friction strip along the trough to slow down movements and dissipate force, and a rubber lip on the feeders. You’d think they would actually play the game before shipping it out.
Also, can we please talk about how a LITERAL DRIVETRAIN TEAM can get their team like 30 points?! Also, drivetrains can push the octoballs into the bottom scoring tube thing in the middle.
They also made the herobot actually functional…
My point being, they tried to make the season super easy.
When I was watching worlds, I remember them saying they worked on the season for two years. Yet, it seems really rushed, and they didn’t test the season at all.
The probably did, and probably want it to be like this. What I don’t understand is why most people on here are constantly blaming the gdc for things that aren’t even a problem yet.
Why do you believe that they want it to be like this? The performance of the field in reality directly contrasts the performance shown in the game reveal. If they wanted the octoballs to shoot through the tubes and only have like 3 in at once, they would have shown that in the video. The video very much makes it seem that the intent is that most normal scoring interactions (ie not crazy high powered shooters or something) would push ONE octoball in, and, if the tube is full, push ONE out. And, the video also shows that dropping octoballs into the match loaders leaves it in the loader.
I am assuming that GDC meant for the game to function as it does in the animation, because why would they not?
And people are angry about this because people have already paid 900 dollars for a field so that they can practice and get a start on designing their robots, and the field feels sloppy and like no actual testing occurred to make sure it worked. Simply enough: You don’t sell a product which doesn’t work.
VEX shouldn’t just be a game for the best of the best with their meta bots and near perfect build and drive techniques. I think the problem is if the drivetrain bot would be the best bot, but it won’t be. I think it’s good that every team can contribute, and simple games can still work. Look at Over Under, technically, drivetrain bots could contribute a lot to their alliance, but they weren’t meta.
Why do you think the GDC didn’t test the game? Do you really think the just designed the game and released it without any testing? To answer your question they designed it like this probably to promote more creative designs. If it was easy to score consistently, there wouldn’t be a challenge. Instead of complaining about what you call field defects, why not just try to solve the problem? For example, if an intake applies too much force on the blocks that they slide out, then slow down the intake or apply less horizontal force on the blocks. Complaining about their decisions do nothing for the forums, as well as arguing. As such, now that I have explained my position, I will not respond to any further rebuttals on the topic.
This is a good thing. One of VEX’s stated goals with robotics competitions is to make it possible for new teams each year to participate. A big part of that is a new game each year requiring different mechanical functions so every team is starting fresh.
Another part is making it possible for teams that are just building a drivetrain to at least score and contribute. High Stakes was extremely weird for not having anything a “pushbot” could do, for the several years before that you could always score something just pushing objects around.
Additionally scoring 30 points is fine for a drivetrain team. This isn’t high stakes anymore, max score is now 206. If the drivetrains can double park but only push balls, I think the highest score would be 57, so they can contribute, but you definitely aren’t winning states with that.
Something simpler would be a 1" wide 1/2" thick strip of foam weather stripping on the bottom of the goal. That would make it less slick.
But being in the game for less than a week, let’s take time for all of us to get game elements and build a robot. Remember, 48 week until your local Championship is a long time.
This may help explain some of the “flaws” of this years game. I think its going to be an interesting year, and i doubt the GDC didn’t intend for most of these things to happen. I think the large descoring methods are going to lead to some cool moments. Strategy looks a little different from previous years, but thats ok. I personally think most teams will be hoarding or camping at the edge of goals until the end, and then the last 30ish seconds will be intense scoring and descoring.
Also, note that no teams are posting videos of blocks falling out when the loaders are connected to the wall. I think, as the video says, the problem is solved when they’re mounted.
Finally, adressing the video about the blocks being thrown out once 2 or 3 were in, i think combines might not becthe way to go. Im excited for the challenge of loading fast, but ensuring it doesnt fling others out.
Overall, i think some of us are kinda overreacting. I was originally super nervous when i first saw these videos, but now I think the GDC designed a really good game. I’m pretty excited to see how game strategy develops with these rules that have never been seen before.
Yea I agree. My school has a very low robotics budget and im not sure if we can afford repairs.
Also I feel like the game itself has flaws (every game does, this one especially) not only field structure but the basic bot design as they showed in the video.
Also, the game elements are smaller than last year but still need a bigger intake (if that’s the way you go)
Last thing, the game encourages simple strategy with little wiggle room, also with first year teams with only a push-bot can’t do much.
Tho, think about it, it’s like the positive corners from last year or the climbing from last year AND over under.
They always find a way to give extra points for more advanced teams in the league.
yes actually now im starting to see your point. These large descores really makes strategies more complicated and interesting.
However, in the game reveal video, they really emphasised the mechanic of one ball pushing out the other. However, what’s the point of that if you can just desire everything in one go. and after the game video was played, during the irl, breakdown, they specifically talked about how the ends were exposed and robots could descale those areas. so these pieces of evidence led me to believe that the GDC didn’t intend for these large descores in one go, and rather opted for smaller descores by sowing or descores on the ends.
But since these descores are possible. matches would be more interesting. We will see a lot more upsets, and last second plays that we all love.
This might be a pretty controversial opinion, but giving lower-level teams an opportunity shouldn’t come at the cost of higher-level innovation. While supporting beginners is great, the current Push Back rules and game element designs seem to align with the philosophy of “make beginners better by dragging experts down”, which I don’t think is what most teams want.
