States that During the AUTONOMOUS skills challenge, if there are any game elements attached to the robot when you want to put your robot back into the starting position then the drivers can move them to a non-scored position. states you cannot use this for strategical purpose In the teamwork challenge. also states that applies to the Driver skills challenge. I was wondering if I could use as a strategy without getting disqualified or put out of the match.
Thank you, this opens up a whole new strategy for our program.
So you are going to lift a blue cube in autonomous, then reset your but to the other side and place the cube in a non scored position right in front of your bot and then just push it in the corner?
I was thinking more like picking up both blue cubes at one time, then resetting it, then put it right in front of the scoring goal(non-scored) then go up there and push it in an inch, and same for the other.
Put the cube right in front of the goal
I think it’s legal, but you will have a hard time at an event without an official ruling.
Please tell me VEX is going to fix this. This is a horrible thing and does not teach the kids good things about programming. It is allowed cheating.
I agree with tpajns, I hope this gets addressed. It seems like it’s well outside the spirit of the game.
I also think you will have a hard time positioning it just outside the scoring zone without moving/disturbing the other scoring objects. Looking at the drawing of the field, a red cube shouldn’t fit between a blue cube and the field wall.
this rule has existed for years it isant really a loophole and while i do agree with @tpajns that it is favoring bad (open loop)code but it helps teams if they missalighn their bot and need to reset it
No, what is new is that the kids are allowed to reset ELEMENTS. Before they always had to take them off the field.
I see y’all’s point of view, and I also understand that. What I see out of this is that if your students, kids, or yourselves can figure this out by yourself, it can help you with problem solving, and strategizing.
well last year there were 17 hubs and this year there are only 7 boxes and it seems silly to remove one completly
I think figuring out how to actually program the robot to carry the blocks from one end of the field to the other and get them in the scoring zones would be more applicable problem solving. That’s what my roboteers are doing.
yeah but the teams an only relocate the robot not the cubes
Maybe the rule for auton should be updated to state that you can place elements back to their original position on the field instead of in any non-scoring position. This may work better for the cubes. I know balls would be difficult to reset.
The most challenging part of auton in previous seasons is that if your robot is just a bit off, it totally messes things up. And in seasons past if you touch the robot while it’s holding an element that element gets taken out of play. That hurts the most, and makes autonomous very unforgiving. Last season our kids talked about that. If they saw the robot was stuck it may be better just to grab it and lose the points of the hub it was holding, and run the next part in the program. That actually happened in a tournament where while trying to score the 8 points in the square zone, the robot was stuck and the code was waiting for the motor movement to be complete. After a few seconds our programmer just picked up the robot and forfeited the 4 points since it was holding the yellow cube. But we ran the next portion of the code and got 9 points for a total of 17.
OP was correct - any scoring elements the robot is holding can be gently placed in a non scoring position
If a referee sees a team intentionally trying to gain an advantage by doing this, they will be able to take action. G17 still applies, with the addition of RSC5.
Here is the full < G17 > , emphasis mine:
< G17 > Handling the Robot mid-match is allowed under certain circumstances. If a Robot goes completely outside the playing Field, gets stuck, tips over, or otherwise requires assistance, the Team’s Drivers may retrieve & reset the Robot. To do so, they must:
a. Signal the Head Referee by placing their VEX IQ Controller on the ground.
b. Move the Robot to any legal Starting Position.
c. Any Game Object being controlled by the Robot while being handled must be removed from the Robot and gently placed in a non-Scored position by the Team.
d. Any Game Objects in the Starting Position may be moved out of the Starting Position and gently placed into a non-Scored position by the Team.
This rule is intended so Teams can fix damaged Robots or help get their Robots “out of trouble.” It is not intended for Teams to use as part of a strategy to gain an advantage during a Match, including via moving Game Objects per parts c and d above. If a Head Referee sees Teams strategically exploiting this rule, they may be Disqualified from said Match.
< RSC5 > overrides part of < G17 > for programming, but not all of it. The bolded portion still applies. Sorry for any confusion I may have caused.
I still think some clarity is needed as to where the cube should go during a normal reset of the robot, if there ever should be such a thing. It would be advantageous for the team to put it back in its original position… Would that be OK?
For example, a team is going to score the green cube on the platform and it gets off course. The team then resets the bot before it drops the cube. Could they put it the green cube back into its original position to give it another go?
I updated my question to include this scenario.
Agree. My interpretation would be that it is placed in a non scoring position directly where the robot was retrieved from. Clarification would be good.