Injustice in the RECF (448X)

[DanMantz]

@Anomaly

Could you release these complaints with timestamps? 448X said privately that some of the complaints the RECF forwarded to them came from people who initially backed them and then realigned their positions once they were contacted by RECF employees. I don’t mean this as a personal attack against anyone in particular, but it is consistent with what @Aeden_6007 posted regarding the whole qualification fiasco last year. Who did these complaints come from? Where they based on pre held grudges against 448X or actual G1 violations with compelling evidence? Is there any video or audio showing that 448X violated G1, or is this just loosely based on the complaints of anon sources?

I can not release them. These are private emails and correspondence sent to the RECF. It is factually incorrect that any of these people realigned their positions because they reached out to us.

The team was disqualified forbehavior that was inconsistent with both the code of conduct and rule of the game manual.

Per my earlier post "It is true that I requested that the school administration and parents were also present on the call. I did this for transparency for all involved parties (including me). "

I can not release the evidence involved. There are very strict privacy laws that the REC Foundation must adhere to.

I am trying to be transparent. And you are making unfounded accusations again. There was no fabricated evidence. Tarek became involved after the complaints were made. I honestly find this repeated attack on him very troubling and implore you to stop.

[Chris_Programming]

@DanMantz

The team was disqualified forbehavior that was inconsistent with both the code of conduct and rule of the game manual.

So what you are saying is that there is no evidence?

[nJeunG]

I think he is saying that he cannot publicly release this evidence due to privacy policies.

[JuiceBox]

The dude said he is not allowed to release the evidence them due to privacy laws chill.

[Chris_Programming]

@JuiceBox

The dude said he is not allowed to release the evidence them due to privacy laws chill.

Then release it to the team. It doesn’t need to be on the forum

[nJeunG]

But then you risk the team publicly releasing it, which still goes against privacy policy. 448 would have to sign an NDA or something like that.

[Manaria]

I can’t completely agree with your analysis but I still respect your perspective and appreciate your input.

For us, a team with all high school senior, who has been denied the appeals many times and has understood that it is impossible to go back to the World Competition now, what can be the possible change that this team is trying to affect for their own personal gain?

For me personally, this is the last season of VEX robotics since I do not intend to participate in VEXU. I simply do not wish this kind of situation happen again to anyone anymore.

I don’t want to claim to be absolutely altruistic and correct at any time since it’s hypocritical. But when someone suggested that our motivation behind the post is ill, I felt the need to explain myself better. Hope this can give you a better understanding of our motivation.

Again, thank you for taking time to read and offer your generous input.

Edit 1: correct spelling

[Sylvie]

No. He said that he legally can’t release evidence. You know those little notes at the bottom of many emails you get from a company email adress? The ones that say, “confidentially notice”. Yeah, those. They legally can’t share those.

[Robo_Eng_13]

1. There is not a case. This is not a legal proceeding. You are not entitled to a trial.

2. There is no evidence or proof, there is complaints and “testimonials”. Dan could present 100,000,000 detailed complaints from verified individuals, and no one here would care. You would still counter with “but we also have people who say we didn’t do anything”.

3. No responsible head of an organization would give identifying information about people who have made complaints to an angry mob who are going to support the team who was “wronged” by the big bad adults. Several people have made it clear, if you agree with RECF you must be wrong. Some are less charitable.

[henryl]

Since 448 is a major stakeholder in this process, I agree a non-disclosure agreement with the organization would be appropriate.

[FT_Roboducks_B]

Would it not be possible for you to release at least the allegations against team 448x? I’m not talking evidence here, I feel like most people just want to know WHAT it is that they did, not evidence of it. All we know is they supposedly violated rule G1 not how they did. That alone should rest some of the tension here and help bring understanding to the situation.

Also, thank you for taking time out of your day to address the community.

[Chris_Programming]

@henryl

Since 448 is a major stakeholder in this process, I agree a non-disclosure act with the organization would be appropriate.

This isn’t a law suit yet. There is no legal requirements to see the evidence against you.

[henryl]

Yes, but at least since the decision here is final, it would help them to understand.

[Sylvie]

@Chris_Programming

This isn’t a law suit yet

And it will never be, unless RECF breaks the law by leaking the evidence

[375X_Robotics]

Dan can you give anyback ground to why this is required to be private? Im just wondering…

[Chris_Programming]

" One of the enumerated rights in the [6th Amendment] is the right to be confronted with the witnesses against the accused. This right is known as the Confrontation Clause. The confrontation clause guarantees criminal defendants the opportunity to face the prosecution’s witnesses in the case against them and dispute the witnesses’ testimony. This guarantee applies to both statements made in court and statements made outside of court that are offered as evidence during trial."

The 6th amendment of the United States Constitution allows people to see the evidence brought against them.

[FT_Roboducks_B]

This isn’t a legal court case or anything remotely like that lol. The amendments apply to interactions with the government not vex robotics.

[henryl]

No crimes were perpetrated here, and RECF is its own independent company. All I’m saying is that since the decision is final, and there’s no moving it, it would just be a nice thing to let the people who were DQd to at least see the reasoning.

[Sylvie]

THIS ISN’T A LEGAL PROCEEDING. It’s a private company. They don’t have to follow the same rules as the US government.

[nJeunG]

I don’t think you should keep pushing for release of evidence. They can show 448 if they want and when they want. It isn’t helping anyone and Dan made it clear that the evidence isn’t being released. If it were released to 448 anyhow, they don’t need a public announcement